tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post6412027861351246498..comments2024-01-20T07:17:13.678-05:00Comments on Phil Wyman's Square No More: Ken Silva Calls Me Out - The Gathering as Clueless, Blind GuidesPastor Philhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-48758437972454312102007-09-10T23:38:00.000-04:002007-09-10T23:38:00.000-04:00AHHH! I just wan tot say that "The discerning Chrs...AHHH! I just wan tot say that "The discerning Chrsitian" can hear the voice of the sheperd without the noise of the church voices telling them what to hear.trishhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00831423862847388651noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-1178800019178774752007-09-05T18:46:00.000-04:002007-09-05T18:46:00.000-04:00I'm just glad that there's a guy like Ken Silva to...I'm just glad that there's a guy like Ken Silva to set us all straight when we've gone astray.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-2633715429695290192007-09-01T03:44:00.000-04:002007-09-01T03:44:00.000-04:00Interesting that emergent "commentors " label ever...Interesting that emergent "commentors " label everything outside the box in the same way, and seem unable to break free from their narrowness of vision. <BR/><BR/>As far as being emergent goes I wouldn't put myself in that category either... <BR/><BR/>Dialogue is essential- constructive dialogue that is, it saddens me that there are som many snipes on line!Sallyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01759963926280667938noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-75549810429426146072007-08-28T13:14:00.000-04:002007-08-28T13:14:00.000-04:00Jeff,Wise observation. Thanks for the gracious re...Jeff,<BR/><BR/>Wise observation. Thanks for the gracious reminder. Perhaps there will be a day when more people get it. I'm hoping that we don't have to wait until the judgment throne, but I'm not holding my theologically conservative breathe, but rather releasing it in liberal fashion.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-9139966300299702572007-08-28T13:12:00.000-04:002007-08-28T13:12:00.000-04:00Hey Mike (Cernie),What? I'm not extreme? ;-)Hey Mike (Cernie),<BR/><BR/>What? I'm not extreme? ;-)Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-75834309265173639732007-08-28T13:11:00.000-04:002007-08-28T13:11:00.000-04:00Hey Anon (wish I knew who you were here),That was ...Hey Anon (wish I knew who you were here),<BR/><BR/>That was funny.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-43859083202296987572007-08-28T13:10:00.000-04:002007-08-28T13:10:00.000-04:00Steve (ol' Thorney bro from Boston),Thanks for a g...Steve (ol' Thorney bro from Boston),<BR/><BR/>Thanks for a good word here. I have found many a time when Witches have defended me against other Christians. Now I find that weird, but enheartening, and as my world grows stranger, it also grows with grace.<BR/><BR/>I am not highly concerned about Ken, but rather realize he is on a mission - perhaps self imposed, but on mission nonetheless. It will take an act of God to stop it I assume.<BR/><BR/>Not being particularly emergent, but not being particularly anything else either puts me in a strange place I suppose. Hammered by the right, but being more right theologically, loved by the left, and finding myself embracing new friends, and enjoying their company.<BR/><BR/>Gwyn dy fyd brawd - thanks.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-13519098367091992182007-08-26T15:00:00.000-04:002007-08-26T15:00:00.000-04:00The thing that gets me is that he paints the emerg...The thing that gets me is that he paints the emerging church as "liberal." I think the biggest "plank" of the emerging movement is a general abandonment of "conservative" and "liberal". It is filled with a bunch of people who don't know which they are (and frankly don't care) because they choose to look at each issue with fresh eyes, and so can be aligned with the "extreme liberal" at one moment and with the "extreme conservative" in the next. <BR/><BR/>People who use tags like "liberal" and "conservative" in regards to the emerging movement only show their ignorance about what is happening.Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11745372066042473985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-58141162565700056412007-08-25T14:48:00.000-04:002007-08-25T14:48:00.000-04:00Looking at Ken's site...... he really does have hi...Looking at Ken's site...... he really does have his panties in a bunch about the emergent church. He seems to be painting a picture that suggests the emergent movement is very one sided and uber-liberal, and in doing so, is painint a picture of his take on Christianity as being very one sided and uber-conservative.<BR/><BR/>So, does that mean that followers of the Christian faith must follow an extreme?<BR/><BR/>BB<BR/><BR/>Mikecernhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06159048983588703450noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-9053447031062991752007-08-22T22:21:00.000-04:002007-08-22T22:21:00.000-04:00Anyone notice that there are no leaves on the tree...Anyone notice that there are no leaves on the trees on Silva's site pic? Black and white and dreary gray. Is that a Freudian slip? Looks like the Orcs run free there. <BR/><BR/>It reminds of a land where it is "always winter and never Christmas."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-46117263501176906562007-08-22T20:20:00.000-04:002007-08-22T20:20:00.000-04:00My friend. Please do not let a someone like Silva ...My friend. Please do not let a someone like Silva get to you. The guy has a fetish for being a one man religion. He gets off on finding people to isolate himself from and attack from a distance. He has been tagged and had his backside tanned by others who revealed his LIES. If you simply drove by the guy's house you would see how much of a failure the guy's ministry is. Unfortunately, the internet tends to take creepos and allow them to hide and appear to be bigger than they are. Silva is nothing more than a guy who loves to feel unloved and unnaccepted and lives to spread the disease of pain. He is proof that Christianity is a religion that almost never confronts its wolves (and which is why I consider myself a follower of Jesus and not a Christian) and note that I said, almost never. <BR/><BR/>Anyway, don't let this fruit loop get to you. He lives to use his religion as an island to isolate himself from others. For all my witch friends reading, there are many people like Phil in Christianity and many people like Silva. And it is time that we publicly defend people like Phil and publicly rebuke people like Silva. Beware, witches of people like Silva. His Jesus hates you. And if Phil's Jesus loves you then....well, someone is not serving the real Jesus. And for my money, I would rather follow Phil's Jesus than than the one Silva is preaching about. Folks like Silva have a neural pathway that gets off on using religion to isolate others. Hence, its a false representation of Jesus and His ministry and needs to be called just what it is.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-16175938676084094212007-08-22T04:51:00.000-04:002007-08-22T04:51:00.000-04:00So Bruce, I thought I'd respond.I love your post,...So Bruce, I thought I'd respond.<BR/><BR/>I love your post, which is quite unique coming from an ol' Pentecostal boy like you, but I was wondering how you saw Emergent as an amalgam of New Age and Orthodox Christianity. I do not see that at all. Postmodernism is one thing, but New Age is another thing altogether methinks. Could you put that brilliant Philosophical Professor's hat on and connect these dots for me?Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-36616391207628831312007-08-22T04:47:00.000-04:002007-08-22T04:47:00.000-04:00Hey Gang,Here was a great post by Bruce, he sent i...Hey Gang,<BR/><BR/>Here was a great post by Bruce, he sent it to my e-mail address so I thought I'd post it here:<BR/><BR/>"I mean nothing against any of my friends by my comments here. But,<BR/>:-o, I think that faithful Roman Catholicism is "this close" to the<BR/>magisterial Reformers, and both of them are closely rooted to the<BR/>orthodoxies of historic Christianity. I'm not clear on what Ken can<BR/>be getting at. If it becomes real important, I'll study his article<BR/>directly.<BR/><BR/>As far as American versions of Xity go, anything related to Moody or<BR/>Finney --i.e. close to the anabaptist tradition-- will work well with<BR/>Emergent emphases. Neither strike me as being doctrinally rigorous,<BR/>well, none of the three, but it's *still* possible to live out a<BR/>dynamic (pietistic) faith inside a Moody-style, or Finney-style, or<BR/>Emergent-style faith.<BR/><BR/>Compared to anything anabaptist-y, RC and Ref Christianity seem<BR/>hopelessly "modernist." Emergence strikes me as being the adaptation<BR/>of a New Age mindset with orthodox Christianity. Way, way, too<BR/>syncretistic to make me happy...but...I rejoice to see Christ<BR/>preached.<BR/><BR/>Bruce"Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-16446593440126079562007-08-22T04:44:00.000-04:002007-08-22T04:44:00.000-04:00Hey Jeff,Hey what's a little more pain. A little ...Hey Jeff,<BR/><BR/>Hey what's a little more pain. A little pin prick after a few stabbings is minor. ;-)Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-26697657993257777922007-08-22T04:42:00.000-04:002007-08-22T04:42:00.000-04:00Hey AussieMac,Thanks for popping in.I find your qu...Hey AussieMac,<BR/><BR/>Thanks for popping in.<BR/><BR/>I find your questions even more confusing than you find mine I am sure. Check out our doctrinal page on our website www.salemgathering.com and you will find all the info you need. You will see that I hold to all the basic Christian truths you ask about here.<BR/><BR/>I suppose I am wondering what liking "conventional church", and agreeing with these basic Christian truths have to do with one another. Of course, I really have been trying to adapt conventional Christianity gathering style, not do away with it.<BR/><BR/>Could it be possible to create a more interactive environment and still believe the doctrine of the apostles?Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-17925759217638625662007-08-21T23:35:00.000-04:002007-08-21T23:35:00.000-04:00Phil - Well, I can probably find you one, but why ...Phil - Well, I can probably find you one, but why would you want to pin anything to your chest? Wouldn't that hurt?Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11745372066042473985noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-84938388426540043522007-08-21T21:17:00.000-04:002007-08-21T21:17:00.000-04:00I'm a little confused here. What makes your Jesus ...I'm a little confused here. What makes your Jesus any different from Buddha or the Dalai Lama? What is it, exactly, about conventional church that you don't like. I guess what I'm asking is this:<BR/><BR/>Is Jesus the Son of God who died for our sins?<BR/><BR/>Is sin still relevant?<BR/><BR/>Other than teaching us to love each other and God with all our hearts, (which goes without saying) is there something else He requires of us?<BR/><BR/>Is there ultimate truth and can it be found in scripture?<BR/><BR/>BTW I don't attend any church. Just wondering what you guys are all about.<BR/><BR/>Mac in AustraliaAlf Cengiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08240699973297720789noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-20896091610980834172007-08-21T17:59:00.000-04:002007-08-21T17:59:00.000-04:00Good point. Makes sense. I guess I would then say ...Good point. Makes sense. I guess I would then say he goes about the wrong way in his processing of judgement.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-44242478129875877852007-08-21T04:22:00.000-04:002007-08-21T04:22:00.000-04:00Jeff,Thanks. Do I get a medal to pin on my chest?...Jeff,<BR/><BR/>Thanks. Do I get a medal to pin on my chest? I can add it to my series of purple hearts.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-64387177174658796742007-08-21T04:20:00.000-04:002007-08-21T04:20:00.000-04:00Hey Carl,What's with the cool photo? Ken's judgme...Hey Carl,<BR/><BR/>What's with the cool photo? Ken's judgments are not quick, as much as they are developed from his personal sense of calling. I would imagine from the massive amounts of material he has generated against anything remotely close to being Emergent that he thinks about this stuff daily, and believes he is called by God to do so. So he is thinking through this all the time.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-1618276623765139682007-08-21T04:16:00.000-04:002007-08-21T04:16:00.000-04:00Agent B you ol' shudderbug,Peace on you bro.Agent B you ol' shudderbug,<BR/><BR/>Peace on you bro.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-33628178866029688312007-08-21T04:15:00.000-04:002007-08-21T04:15:00.000-04:00Oh David,You have been, and will be bro.Oh David,<BR/><BR/>You have been, and will be bro.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-64260997402624972142007-08-21T04:14:00.000-04:002007-08-21T04:14:00.000-04:00Ken,Mike and Jules Clawson? No. I don't know who...Ken,<BR/><BR/>Mike and Jules Clawson? No. I don't know who they are.<BR/><BR/>Roman Catholic Bondage: I am not a fan of Roman Catholic theology or practice. Yet, I know Catholics who are not "in bondage." I know others who are, and still more who are only Catholic by name. I am sure all churches have that spectrum of followers - perhaps even your small house church, and my little gathering of believers. I actually hope to have that spectrum of Christians (inserting this word so as not be called Catholic by you) at The Gathering, because it means we are influencing people at all levels of faith.<BR/><BR/>Now as far as you being in bondage: The times I have read your material (which have been few, but covered quite a number of posts) I see only addiction to a narrow definition of Christianity, and a quick dismissal of Emergent and/or Popular Christianity. Now I am not really defined as emergent myself, and certainly do not hold to the more liberal theological or moral leanings of some of the emergent clan. I also am not a fan of the mega-church model, and popular movements of Christianity. Yet I also find myself wanting to distance myself from narrow definitions which reject people for such things as their style of gathering, or redescribing (not redefining) faith for the sake of reaching a generation. You on the other hand, seem to insist that your narrow entrance to the Kingdom is only wide enough for Reformers. Are you sure this is judging righteous judgment, and not unrightly judging instead?Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-49835688261417662032007-08-21T03:39:00.000-04:002007-08-21T03:39:00.000-04:00Hi Steve,We were spending time with people who mig...Hi Steve,<BR/><BR/>We were spending time with people who might your area, and it went well. It is amazing to find people trekking through alternative festivals who have rejected our traditional modes of Christianity, and yet still desire to know Jesus. This was a common theme during our travels.<BR/><BR/>I wonder if Ken ever meets these kinds of people, and I wonder what he might do with them.<BR/><BR/>I think I'll ask when I meet him.Pastor Philhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07344719487413688550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28637516.post-57815846027841314242007-08-20T23:44:00.000-04:002007-08-20T23:44:00.000-04:00Ken Silva is against you?Well done my friend! Davi...Ken Silva is against you?<BR/><BR/>Well done my friend! <BR/><BR/>David - don't worry, I've been reading your blog and I have a feeling that Ken will be getting around to you soon. It's just that God's grace is so broad, and Ken's vision is so narrow, that it really is overwhelming for one single man. But I'll be praying that you fall under his wrath soon. :)Jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11745372066042473985noreply@blogger.com